ITC press conference 22 June 2020

OK, Good afternoon, everyone.

It's good to see some of you again today and sorry those of you here in the room and those of you who are online.

The past few months have been very difficult for most people, but harder for many and especially for those that have lost someone and fallen.

I'll, the COVID-19 pandemic has also had a severe impact on trade and business.

Some are pleased to be joined today by ITC Acting Executive Director, Dorothy Thamble and our Chief Economist, Marion Jansen for the release of the 2020 SME Competitiveness Outlook.

The great the great lockdown and its impact on small business.

So without much further ado, I will ask Miss Tamble to provide you with the headlines of this year's report, after which Miss Jansen will provide more details on the findings.

[Other language spoken]

Thank you very much, Yale, and good afternoon to everybody.

I wish to thank you all for being able to join us this afternoon.

This year we know has started on very, very on a very, very challenging note.

Before we closed 2019, we knew that 2020 would be turbulent, having seen the different discussions that were going on in relation to trade and the accompanying tensions there.

We also were very much alive to the fact that they were a lot of issues being raised with respect to issues around equality, as were there issues in relation to climate change, as where discussions relating to the financial side.

So of course, with all this going on, we knew that 2020 would not be an easy year for us, but one that would pose challenges.

Little did we know that we could find ourselves in the current situation that is confronting us.

Little did we know at that point that we would have a major health crisis on our hands that would bring a lot of implications not only on the health side, but also on the economic side.

A few months into COVID-19, we have come to see the, the implications, the huge implications that it has had on, on us as families, us as the community, us as the, the, the, the globe and us indeed in relation to, to trade, as the moderator just highlighted.

And we felt it was imperative that as an organisation that is tasked with the responsibility of working with micro, small and medium enterprises in particular, driving their competitiveness to ensure that they are not only able to trade, but that's through that they would be making a major contribution in terms of improving the economies of the developing countries in particular.

Because that's our constituency.

But ultimately, it's all countries as, as we as we would see it.

And therefore it became important that we moved forward and shifted our work from preparing an SME competitiveness report that focused on all the other elements that I alluded to and refocused our energies on.

Looking specifically at COVID-19 and it's implications on micro, small and medium enterprises, we have been informed by the World Trade Organisation that trade could fall this year by between 12 to 32%.

Only last week, Ankta had informed us that the foreign direct investment may fall by 40%.

The IMF also informed us in April that global GDP may fall by 3%.

We add new numbers to this discussion through the report that we are launching today.

What is it that we are adding?

55% of businesses across the globe face severe negative impacts from this crisis.

Second point is that 20% of small medium enterprises have told us that they may not be able to survive the next three months, which is really, really critical because the implications of that would be far reaching.

And bearing in mind that they the the the importance of micro, small and medium enterprises is one that is really, really key to our success going into the future.

You will not that even in the context of the Sustainable Development Goals, it has been put at the centre of us being able to deliver and therefore being taken as an engine for for growth.

And within all that we have SM ES providing employment for around 70% of the global workforce.

For the developing countries, this number is even higher and therefore it gives us the the the core reason for us to move forward and try to better understand what these implications arising out of such a crisis would be for many, many of our countries.

We have done some calculations and here 15% of the jobs could be at risk because of this crisis and therefore it is and remains a valid point that we try and address these issues in more concrete ways.

So what is it that ITC has been doing up to this more up to this point in terms of supporting small and medium enterprises and what is it that we have deduced from the report that will be presented to you in a short while?

The first point is that through our network of partner organisations, we have reached out to many micro, small and medium enterprises across the globe to understand their concerns and needs.

I think it's only when you understand from those that are directly affected will you be able to provide a response that is relevant but a response that is also effective and enables a change or indeed in this particular case, in the initial phases, ensures that the firms are actually sustained.

2nd is that we have developed a 15 point plan providing concrete advice to small businesses, business support organisation and indeed governments to jointly help micro, small and medium enterprises through the COVID-19 crisis and towards the future.

It is about now, but it is also more to do with the future.

How do we ensure that these firms are not only sustained but can also grow in the future?

And what I have elaborated here is all contained in the report that you have before you today.

The third dimension is that in the field we are helping businesses and business support organisations and governments to implement the action plan, thus developing an agile response to the crisis and you will find a number of examples in the report that we have shared.

Our assistance to the firms has taken multiple forms and I wanted to touch on this very briefly.

First is ensuring that we are providing the necessary information that helps the firms understand their context, but also more importantly, that provides them with the basis for making informed decisions.

This process is one that we have also found very valuable in terms of understanding what is working on the ground for the companies and what is not working.

And that combining all this information, we are able to respond as an entity, but also through our partners that we are able to provide that assistance that is so much needed in this particular phase.

Second point is that we are moving businesses to do business online and 3rd, we have also been working with the firms to move to new product lines where possible.

EG we have some companies in West Africa that have moved from producing textiles to producing masks which are so much needed in this particular situation.

4th, we have been coming up working with the firms with longer term plans for their businesses.

This is really to look beyond sustaining the firms at this point, but looking at how they can grow themselves in the future.

5th is the element of capacity building which we have been providing through various webinars that we have been able to to to provide to these companies.

It's that hand holding which is critical in this phase for them to know.

Not only that are we there to support the process, that we are also able to give very valuable knowledge that helps them navigate themselves through this complicated situation.

6th is we are working with partners such as the International as such as the World Trade Organisation and indeed Acted who are by the way our parent organisations in providing a platform that consolidated all trade related information in one place.

And this speaks to the earlier point that I had made.

When this information is one place, it's much easier for the companies to navigate and understand what the market requirements are, but also to better understand what it is that will have a negative impact on their businesses.

And finally, we are also an integral part of the one UN COVID-19 response on the social economic pillar.

So we are working with the other parts of the United Nations to make sure that we have a coordinated response that is effective, but being led on the ground by our colleagues, the resident coordinators, in close collaboration with the governments and the different stakeholders to respond to their specific needs.

So these are some of the areas that we have been working, working on The experience and evidence that we have collected over the last four months has been compiled in the report that is again to be presented to you.

We have drawn on this experience as we have drawn from the various other aspects of or pieces of work that we have undertaken to help us to be in a position to make to make recommendations that I will come to as I close my intervention.

A few aspects that I just wanted to stress on as observations that we have made from our side, which are key messages also coming out of the report.

1 is that lock downs in China, the European Union and the United States will lead to global losses amounting to $126 billion in 2020.

Second point, Asia is the region where trade suffers most from the lockdowns in these three economies, with the European lockdown being the one with the greatest effects on both Asia and Africa.

Third, export bans and other restrictions cover 73% of worldwide trade in COVID-19 related products.

And 4th, over 60% of micro and small firms suffer from strong negative effects from the crisis, compared with 40% of larger firms.

You as readers will also discover that a new Africa growth model may what a what a new Africa growth model may look like in post COVID world.

And thanks to the thought leadership contribution from Wamkele Mene, the new Secretary General of the African Continental Free Trade Secretariat, I think this puts forward a clear sense of how some of the countries and indeed the regions are starting to navigate what is a considerably trying.

By looking at potential opportunities as well, which is an important aspect of what we have to do going forward.

So in conclusion, I would want to suggest the following recommendations.

First, while struggling with the immediate consequences of COVID-19 pandemic, companies, business support organisation and indeed policy makers must also urgently adapt to a new normal.

So it's about addressing the immediate issues, but it's also looking at the longer term period.

Second is we must believe that they should be 4 priorities.

We believe as an organisation that there are four priority areas that need to be focused on going forward.

Strengthening the resilience of the small and medium enterprises to withstand future shocks.

Stepping up efforts to help SMEs go digital, making supply chains more open and inclusive, and finally using the crisis to ensure that business across the world becomes more sustainable and climate friendly.

In the outlook or the report that we have shared, we are also making a a huge call for everything of how global supply chains are structured.

And one thing we are proposing is that the lead firms such as potentially the multinationals should rethink the governance structure of supply chains in post pandemic world.

What would this entail?

It would entail lead firms redesigning their approach to collaborating with small and medium enterprises and sharing costs with small and medium enterprises, which would help ensure a more equal distribution of the risks costs in periods of crisis.

Linked to that is that we think this would also help ensure greater mutual trust, but also enable both large and small firms to withstand and respond to future crisis.

In conclusion, I would say the year 2020 is not only the year of COVID-19 pandemic, it is also the year of the 75th anniversary of the United Nations and 25th anniversary of the World Trade Organisation.

All these are important milestones that should bring us all into the sphere of wanting to reflect and see how through these mechanisms we can better work with each other.

The year 2020 may enter history of books as a turning point if that reflection takes us into a direction where we start doing things differently, but doing things differently in a positive way that takes us in a direction that is for the good of our of our globe.

Finally, as we are standing in front of the stack choice between national or regional blocs in permanent lockdown and more, a more carefully and jointly managed open world, ITC stands firmly on the side of the latter by chatting in this report A path out of the economic crisis into a new paradigm.

I want to end by saying I would like to see that this publication is used by every business in each part of the world and that each of these will come up with a plan that keeps them or makes them remain resilient, but also a plan that makes them look to the future, a future that will allow them to grow.

[Other language spoken]

And I hand over, perhaps to Maria.

Yeah, thank you, Dorothy.

Just before handing over to Marian, for those of you who haven't received the slides I sent about an hour ago, please send me an e-mail and I will resend those.

[Other language spoken]

Thank you and thanks all for being here for the release of the AZMI Competitiveness Outlook 2020.

We decided to focus this report entirely on the effect of COVID-19 because of the big effects for main stakeholders at ITC.

The Small and Medium Sized Enterprises title of the report is therefore COVID-19, The Great Lockdown and Its Impact on Small Business.

The next slide will give you information on what this report contains.

You will find a lot of data in this report.

You will find data on the COVID-19 impact on small businesses based on an ITC survey.

You will find data on value chain disruptions, but you also find data useful for building value chains, with a focus on the building of value chains for essential goods, goods essential for addressing health crisis like the one we are just experiencing.

In addition to data you will find policy guidance and Miss Tamba made already reference to this guidance for how to deal with the immediate crisis, but also guidance on how to deal with the new normal.

Here we have a you will find a sub subsection titled Trade Governance for the New Normal.

And as already mentioned, you will find a thought leader contribution by Ram Kilimene, the Secretary General of the Secretariat for the African Continental Free Trade Area.

And the title of that piece is that Thought leader pieces, African Growth, a new model for a post COVID-19 world.

I will walk you through some of the numbers and some of them you have already heard from Miss Tembo here.

For those of you who see the slides, you will find those numbers with charts.

As mentioned already by Miss Tembo on the next slide.

Over 50% of businesses across the world are severely affected by this crisis.

And one thing that is striking is.

That this number holds for all regions over 50% in Europe, in Asia, in the Americas and in Africa, with the percentage being highest for Africa where 2/3 of the businesses tell us that they have been severely affected.

On the next slide, differences are starker when you look at cross sector numbers.

Here we see that some sectors have been affected much more than others and the most affected sectors will not come as a surprise to you.

In the accommodation and food sector, we find that 3/4 of the companies report to have been severely affected in retail and wholesale.

In travel and transport, around 2/3 of businesses tell us to have been severely affected.

In finance and information technology, instead, only 1/3 of companies say we have been suffering severe negative effects.

Now one thought is a big number in normal times.

It's only today that I'm saying it's only 1/3 of the companies.

But you see there are quite some important differences across sector.

Next slide tells you something about the importance of the size of enterprises.

If 55% of companies are affected overall, those effects differ according to firm size.

40% of large enterprises tell us that they are severely affected, 50% of medium sized enterprises and 60% or more of small and micro sized enterprises say that they have been severely affected by the crisis.

The smaller the enterprise, the smaller typically the financial buffer a company can count on in order to go through periods of lower of no revenue.

And it's this vulnerability that we believe is reflected in these numbers.

This vulnerability on the financial side is also behind the number on the next slide and this is a number that I believe we all have to take very seriously.

20% of SMEs of small and medium sized enterprises interviewed tell us that they may go bankrupt within the next three months.

Now if you keep in mind that small and medium sized enterprises around the globe are responsible for more or less 70% of jobs, and then you do a simple bag of the envelope calculation, you'll find that if 1/5 of companies go bankrupt, this would correspond to around 15% of employees losing their jobs.

This is a big number bag of the envelope, yes, but this magnitude corresponds is similar to the magnitudes found in simulations done by the International Labour Office.

Close to 15% of job losses due to possible bankruptcies among SMEs.

This is something to be avoided if possible.

Governments across the globe have introduced measures to help SMEs and we see information is on the next slide.

Well, what we see there is that there is one problem with these measures that maybe governments can solve.

We find that over half of the companies interviewed say they find it difficult or very difficult to get information on what the government is doing for them or to get access to the benefits of the government.

That's a pity because it typically takes policy makers a lot of efforts to agree on policy packages to intervene to help SMEs to find the funding for this.

But if the last mile isn't gone, the last mile of ensuring that firms know what to do to access those benefits, then they will not take advantage of the measures that have been put in place.

So much about the findings, the main findings from our Business Impact survey.

I also mentioned at the beginning that you find data on value chains in this report and on the next slide you see our biggest concern, the one that value chain trade has been interrupted so severely during the crisis.

This does not only have immediate effects on trade and on the benefits from trade, it also can shake, can lower even more the trust that some people may have in international value chains and in international trade.

We therefore look as an agency focusing on trade.

We therefore look very in detail at this phenomenon of value chain trade in the crisis.

And on the next slide, you see that we believe 2 have provided readers with a really unique menu of information to facilitate evidence based decision making on value chains for the next stages as we come out of this crisis.

[Other language spoken]

First, a big picture on value chain disruption across the globe.

As already mentioned by Miss Tembo, big picture is provided by looking at what happens to value chain trade when the three biggest economies of the world, China, the European Union and the United States close down the businesses.

So first, the big picture, second country profiles for 85 countries where you can 5 find information on how value chain disruption has affected or can potentially affect trade in some of the main products they are exporting or how it can affect them on the import side.

So this is zoomed into the country level.

And the third ingredient is very detailed product specific information on what value chain trade looks like for essential goods, goods that are essential to address health crisis like the one of COVID-19.

[Other language spoken]

Who produces what and what does this mean for potential restructuring of value chain trade and production in these fields?

A few numbers around this unique menu that we are proposing in this report.

The next slide you see a a map reflecting how different regions have been affected by these value chain disruptions.

And one caveat here, one thing to keep in mind is that we are not taking into account trade within the European Union as value chain disruption.

European Union is dealt with as one economy and what you see and was already mentioned is that Asia, the the Asian region is the region that may may suffer the biggest losses when their exports of components and intermediates are reduced as an effect of lockdowns in the countries they are exporting to.

On the next slide, you see a table.

Numbers are maybe a bit small, but you put a circle on one of the important numbers.

The lockdown of China, the European Union and the United States have meant reduced imports by both of by all three regions and this affects the exports of the countries they are importing from.

What is interesting is that it's the European Union's lockdown that would have the biggest effect on global trade, bigger than the lockdown of China or the lockdown of United States, because the European Union is the most important importer of intermediate goods.

I've given you 2 pictures, 2 charts belonging to the big picture.

Let me give you an example of a country profile.

On this slide you see one country, Malaysia, again almost too small for you to read, but which you will find here interesting.

For instance, at the bottom you will see in which are the main products.

This country that is heavily integrated in international value chains will suffer losses in when there are lockdowns in its biggest markets and you will also see which of the three big economies this country most depends on.

In this case, Malaysia is an important exporter of electronic ingredients into the value chains mainly towards China.

So you will see reductions in the exports of these kind of goods with a big big exposure to China.

In the case of Malaysia, you will find similar type of evidence for 84 other countries.

I've given you the big picture, some information.

I've shown you an example of a country profile and here the kind of information you'll find on building value shades.

Here you see a picture that is looks very different from the kind of numbers I've just shown you here.

We looked at a product this in fact and in this case that is relevant for health crisis and we look at what is this product made from.

You will need for the disinfectant ethanol, you will need glycerin and then you have to put this this disinfectant into a bottle that you have to close with a cap.

What you will find in the report is where Africa is sourcing this kind of ingredients and where are African producers.

And this will give you hints about how to maybe source inputs differently or how to maybe combine what is produced in the region differently in order to restructure your approach to value chains in disinfectants.

So it gives you information on building value chains.

So I've walked you through the information that we get from the Business Impact Survey.

I have given you some insights into the type of information you can find on value chains.

[Other language spoken]

Stembo has already given you an overview of this.

And yes, she's notably highlighted that we expect that ITC, the new normal to be sustainable, inclusive, digital and resilient.

In the subsection focusing on trade governance for the new normal, we focus on this resilience aspect.

And we have identified a number of new issues that we may want to look at differently in the future when we want, if we want to make trade and in particular value chain trade more resilient.

First, supply chain governance may have to adjust in order for supply chains by chains to become more resilient.

The idea here would be to ensure that all sometimes of crisis, the risks of the crisis are managed jointly among the the lead firms and the suppliers and that may be this kind of joint risk management meant is built into the contracts from the beginning.

Second, we expect a new range of standards and regulations to become a permanent ingredient in the new normal.

It's the type of standards and regulations that are important to avoid the spreading of viruses.

Ecosystems may have to be built in order for these standards and regulations to be applied without hampering trade.

Last but not least, we expect that these changes may need to lead to a bit of a rethinking on the side of multilateralism if we want to look at resilience within value chains and if resilience therefore implies looking at the contracts between suppliers and multinationals and that our standards and regulations are set also within value chains.

That raise leads to the question how supply chains are connected to the policy world of multilateralism.

We are not the first ones to ask that question, but we raise this question now again in the context of COVID-19.

Second, during the crisis, logistics have been disrupted severely and we see that policy makers have been looking at logistics in a different way than we are usually doing in the context of multilateralism.

This may be an element also of the new normal.

And last but not least, we have to keep on watching out for the Nexus between finance and the real economy.

The multilateral trading system does not deal with finance, but it is not disconnected from the finance world.

If the kind of health packages that are brought into the economies now contribute to financial instability, this will also affect trade finance and maybe some of the support that is given to enterprises, which we welcome it.

It is also affecting competitiveness.

So here some thoughts, some food for future further thought about the new normal.

Let me stop with two slides making publicity here again the front page of the new report that will be downloadable under the link you find on this slide.

And last but not least, please join us on Wednesday when we will hold a web TV programme to celebrate the International MSME Day.

And that web TV programme will all be dealing with the themes discussed in this report.

For its title is also the Great lockdown and its impact on small businesses.

And you will be able to listen to over 40 speakers, nearly half of them are actual businesses who will tell you about how they have experienced this crisis.

Join us please, and participate in the discussion using the chat option because this will be a virtual event.

Looking forward to seeing you there.

[Other language spoken]

We're going to take some question and I see that Peter has a question here in in the room.

Yes, my question is for Miss Tilo.

It's a very broad question.

Miss Jansen said that SMEs account for 70% of the world's labour force.

Can you just remind us in a nutshell, why are SME so important when at this time in the world the multinationals and huge companies are growing in their size and impact?

[Other language spoken]

OK, let's take a few more and see if there are anyone online.

Otherwise I have a written question.

OK, so I have a question from Asus Moureira of Valour Economical which refers to the to the country profiles on page 65 about Brazil.

The report mentioned expected losses of 1.161 billion.

Is this referring to SME Brazilian, Brazilian SMEs or Brazilian companies in general?

Similarly, on losses or export import losses of 1.501 billion, does this concern Brazilian SMEs or Brazilian companies in general?

OK, maybe we'll start with those.

Oh, sorry, Boris.

But if you prefer to address the 1st 2:00.

I think, I think we start with those two.

[Other language spoken]

Thank you very much.

I think very pertinent questions being raised there.

I will start with the one that was asking as to why is it still you know the case that we have 70% of SMEs contributing.

Indeed, we do have multinationals that are present in in many, many countries, but it still has to do with the fundamental structure that we have.

So when we look at the totality of the enterprises we have, including those multinationals, we still have 90% being constituted by small and medium enterprises.

So which is why they remain a very critical part of, of of in this particular context.

If, if I may, in, in the context of it, any COVID recovery, we would still have to address ourselves to supporting small and medium enterprises.

If we have, we want to have a holistic response that enables us move in a better direction.

Stuff to answer your question.

Do you want to add anything to that, Miriam?

I maybe answer the Brazilian question, so.

Yeah, I was actually, now I wanted actually to, to explain why in overall terms or SME is so important.

Not, I mean not just particularly during the COVID-19 crisis.

I mean, you know, a lot of people don't understand why SM ES are such a fundamental part of global economies.

I, I, I, I thought I had tried to, to answer that, but I mean, this is the structure that we have.

We do have the multinationals, but the multinationals are not the totality of what is prevailing at the country level.

You still do have those small and medium enterprises that constitute a large part of the contribution to most of these economies and therefore you cannot ignore them in any question.

It's not only about COVID.

Even before COVID, we were very clear that SMEs constitute a larger part of what is pertaining in these countries because this is what is possible.

You have the small players being an integral part of many, many economies and alongside that you do have you know, the issues that confront them in terms of, you know, them maturing to become big, big entities.

But this is not this is not what we have prevailing with us at at present.

The position is that we have 90% of the enterprises with you know 70% of that contribution coming from SMEs.

So you can you cannot ignore them in any equation not very specific to COVID, but even without COVID, this is the structure that we have.

[Other language spoken]

You, Marian, do you want add something to that or you want to jump?

Into maybe I'll just add this an example.

If you look at this sector that has been most affected accommodation and food.

So if you look at this whole sector on tourism, most, many hotels, most hotels will fall into the SME category.

Most restaurants will fall into that category.

Retailing, most shops will fall into that category.

So maybe those are not the big names we know, but the companies we deal with in our daily life and most of them are small and medium sized enterprises.

I would like to add something to the Brazilian question.

So the country profile data, they are based on trade flow data and here we do not distinguish between small and medium sized enterprises.

We have information.

So you see on the country pages that we know which product lines or which sectors are characterised by a heavy as a ME presence.

So sectors with a lot of Asmis, they will have a a green, round, green circle next to the name of the product line.

But the calculations in terms of losses are calculated on overall trade flows.

So that includes all Brazilian companies or all companies in also the other countries?

Thank you, Marion.

Boris, you had a question here.

Yes, Boris Engelsson, a local freelancer.

[Other language spoken]

Indeed, the issues which are addressed in this report are crucial ones, which mean that they have already considerably discussed by in the media or at the workplace.

So my first question, what will be the big surprises I will have after completion of reading this?

This is my first question.

The two next questions as well.

The second one is that the speaker said that 2020 will remain as a year of the pandemics and of the 3/4 of century of the UN system.

But some people wonder whether 2020 should be parallel with 1929 or 1945 and this imply dramatically different scenarios and provisions.

So can you comment on that?

And my third one, page 18, I see that on the average or at least on the world market, if I get it right, a litre of alcohol ethanol is cost approximately $2.00 per litre and in Blessed Switzerland it cost approximately 40 * 20 times that price.

So can you explain me in terms of intentional trades and supply chains, how in Switzerland, since we are rich, we are, we have the privilege of paying 20 times the international trade price?

Thank you, Boris.

Thank you very much.

Perhaps I I start with the the first question, which is the what?

[Other language spoken]

What is the value add that we bring to to a discussion that has been ongoing with a lot of these things being having already been identified.

And here I very much agree with you that it is first and foremost because of the importance we all have come in to try and ensure that we are providing the necessary information of what is it that ITC brings to the table.

ITC, as I said in my introductory remark, is an organisation that is tasked with the responsibility of working directly with micro, small and medium enterprises in enhancing their competitiveness.

That being the case, all the information that we have brought in this report is one that focuses on the private sector, which is perhaps what has not been dwelt on in great detail by others.

You will not from the survey that we did that we reached out exactly to the 4000 plus firms to give us direct information.

We're using that to analyse.

Second point is that we have taken that and not higher by ensuring that in this report we are also making very specific recommendations as to what action can be undertaken.

And I also spoke to some of the steps that we as an organisation are taking in terms of supporting private sector in during this difficult.

So, but to be specific to your question, we are working on providing all the information that pertains to directly to private sector.

So giving us a very clear sense and understanding of what is pertaining on the ground, but also making very concrete suggestions on how we can address some of the challenges that companies are being confronted with.

Do you think there was blind spots in the discussion, in the public discussion so far which this report might help supplementing?

[Other language spoken]

When when I think you go for instance to the issues relating to the value chains, we are very specific in terms of the what is being produced where, what the demand is in certain respects and what can actually be done in terms of the immediate steps.

I think in here you will find that we are making very specific suggestions on how the value chain could actually be repositioned to respond to some of the immediate needs.

For instance, in the context of of Africa, we are talking to the production of we are speaking to the production of the health requirements.

These maybe could be produced within Africa, but of course with a view of not taking a protectionist approach, but with a long term view of you know, moving or growing that value chain with a view of integrating it on at the global level.

So these are some of the aspects that we are bringing here.

But more importantly, it's also the the nitty Gritty's of what we've brought from the engagement with private sector, which I, I personally believe may not have been done to the level of detail that you may see in this report.

Maybe I say something on this price difference.

So it's, it's quite well known that the price we pay in a shop for products that come through a value chain represents is, is much higher than the value of the raw ingredients.

So we, I remember the value chain of the jeans.

Typically if you take a trousers of $50.00, the the trousers have been made for $5 somewhere and what is added is above all branding and retailing also design.

So and what you will of course pay in Switzerland is the price of the retail shop where you are buying this bottle.

The the price jump is by far not as **** even for wine and vodka.

It's that it's it's not, it's not unusual that the price jump is **** for the lower value value products.

So here what you see is the role is the trade the value when you trade the role product.

When it comes to your 19291945 translate comparison, I will not go into depth of this, but I would say it's definitely not 1945 because we haven't seen the kind of destruction of production capacity that we would have experienced after a war.

So there I think there are big differences that would not play out in this current situation.

Sorry, I don't want to prolong too much, but it was not the quantity.

The question I raised was not about quantity, but the dynamic is different.

In one case it is a defensive strategy against poverty impeding poverty and the in the other case it is a relaunch of rail economy.

These are two totally different scenarios.

I don't know which one applies today, but they cannot be addressed at the same time.

It is either one or the other which fits the rally.

Yeah, I, I will, I will attempt to to answer that.

But I, I believe we are all in the in the same space in the sense that at at the present point we don't we do not have clarity in terms of how this situation is actually going to evolve.

So the full impact of the situation is one that is not not known.

Second point, I think for the countries at present it it is one, it is a situation that has adopted a, a more I, I hesitate to use the word defence, but it is more of trying to address an immediate health situation that has confronted the countries.

But in so doing that you have put in place measures that are actually working to counter the very efforts that you have.

You have you have, oh, the gains that you have made over the over the years.

Now where will this put countries in terms of repositioning themselves?

I think this is part of what the conversations as I have followed them are ones that are around around this particular issue trying to better understand beyond the immediate mitigation of the health crisis.

So I, I would not be able to give you in a very definite way it's defensive or it's, it's going towards growing the economies.

But at some point I think it could be defensive to some extent.

But progressively I think the objective by all of us should be one that grows the economies with perhaps different strategies being adopted.

[Other language spoken]

Thank you, Dorothy.

I don't see any more questions online or in the room.

So I'm going to close this down now just to remind you once again to join us on Wednesday for our Web TV event in which you will have the opportunity to hear from more than 40 entrepreneurs, business leaders, policy makers from around the world.

That's at 2:00 on Wednesday, Central European time.

Thank you and have a nice afternoon.

Thank you very much for being here.